Seriously, though, this is pretty much what I expected. Annoying boy scout characters tend to react badly the first time they kill someone. At least Utopian isn’t as one dimensional as Superman.
If think it’s a little late for a cybernetic upgrade, here. He’s dead before he hits the ground. Best they could probably do is freeze his head for future reanimation on a new body. Alas, poor Alaric, we barely knew ye…
Weeelllll, that’s it for Alaric. He’ll need new cybernetic lungs and heart, and I doubt medical tech is up to replacing those in time before he, y’know, dies. Unless he’s got superhuman self-healing abilities (which I doubt cause then he would have regrown his arm) then he’s done.
Now we get to see how powerful Tactical’s new armor is-’cause you KNOW he’ll be wanting to avenge his lover’s death.
Good, the resulting story will be far more interesting if Alaric doesn’t suddenly pop up later feeling all better. We get to see Utopian delaing with having (accidentally) taken a life, and get to see Tactical’s response, which I think is gonna be a doozy.
Looks like U is going to have to watch the blasts made in anger, he can really take a chunk out of you. And the poor guy is going to need theropy after this.
Seriously. I’ve had it up to my eyeballs with pompous bilge from heroes who won’t use deadly force *when it’s warranted*. They will NEVER kill. Nope, never, ever! Never mind they can, and do, frequently *throw baddies through buildings*, they never go that extra little step and use force that MIGHT just kill them.
Wha?
Sorry, but when you’re so powerful you can punch out an armored car, and send out energy blasts that what, make enormous grilled cheese sandwiches, you’re exerting force with deadly propensity. SOMEDAY, you’re gonna hit the guy hard enough to pop his head clean off. Face it, it’s gonna happen. You’ll punch him in the chest, and instead of flattening him against the building with a great KABOOM, causing him to grimace and yell “curse you!”, he’ll clutch at his chest, scream, contort, and fall over with a super-infarction, because you just caused his left ventricle to explode.
And sorry, but when the bad guys wade in with huge monkey-mallets, firing energy blasts of their own, and shredding your friends with energy planes and shouting “die, die, die!” — for which they show NO remorse — this is clearly a self-defense situation, and even though a case might be made that Alaric had his back turned, we don’t know that he was actually *retreating*. Though his hammer had been destroyed, he might well have been turning and falling back to pick up a CAR to use as a new weapon. He’s just that kind of a mean little hairpin, you know? So a case could be made for justified use of force.
I teach self defense with firearms, and the first thing I do is have the person look me in the eye and tell me whether or not they will be willing to use the weapon to defend themselves if someone tries to kill them or cause them grievous bodily harm. If they can’t, or have reservations, I tell them to try pepper spray, or martial arts, or some other kind of defensive tool. If they have not wrestled with that demon AND WON ahead of time, they will hesitate when the time comes, and those seconds can mean their life. Worse, when you hesitate over a moral issue at the critical life-saving juncture, an attacker can TAKE YOUR WEAPON and use it on you, then use it on OTHERS. You have a responsibility to prevent that if possible, by acting, not maundering. If you can’t do it, it’s no dishonor. Just don’t. Use another method.
But a superhero — they have power, they have chosen to use it, they now must use it responsibly. If it is potentially deadly, they must face that propensity, and the fact that their opponent may not be as invulnerable as they are. They must also face that someday, they may have to stop — really STOP — a bad guy who is a danger not just to them, but to others.
And what is the difference between defending yourself and others using an energy blast from your hand, or a .45 acp frangible round, that can leave a cavity in flesh the size of a basketball?
Does make me wonder if Mr. Roboto-Illuminatus whatever it’s called with the eye in the pyramid isn’t somehow messing with Utopian’s power levels so he’ll go out of control.
Well, Demosthenes, I pretty much agree with everything you said. This world is not DC, where most characters would never willingly kill, and would die rather than let a heinous villain die. Most of the title characters wouldn’t think twice about it–self-defense! Johnny Saturn I or II wouldn’t worry about justification, nor would a military guy like Titanium Tom.
But, I propose that Utopian is different. We’ve seen him grow up a lot in this series, from a spoiled arrogant elitist to the hero he is now. But, he’s never had his values tested like this before. And, you’re right, it was inevitable.
I always think of Superman or Captain America, two characters with great ethics and integrity, and yet both have killed when it was the only option left to them. Now it’s time to see if Utopian can man up to it and join their ranks, or be broken.
I see Utopian’s reaction more in the vein of, “I didn’t know I could do that/I didn’t mean to do that!” Basically, you’ve shown him getting physically stronger, and reveling in his new-found strength. Because of this, he has no sense of “blow calibration” in combat – he’s used to projecting his power with a certain amount of effort, and just found out that that effort has resulted in a much larger amount of damage/effect than he’s used to. Seen that way, his reaction is understandable.
Good. I certainly hope it’s more of a “holy crap, how the heck did I do THAT???” kind of thing, and not a “woe is me, I have broken my Unbreakable Code, and am now no longer deserving of the title of Hero!”
The first is far more interesting, and frankly, I think it would be far more believable under the circumstances. The second is far too cheesy, and by Klono, has been so horribly overdone its chestnuts have chestnuts.
Wow… not only was that EPIC, but I think we have an Ender fan in our midst, because that’s the only place I’ve seen the names Demosthenes and Locke together. *lol*
I’ve never seen anybody else take the name of a Space God in vain before either, but DL, sounds to me like you have a very eclectic taste in SF literature.
ESF gets *two* shiny new dimes for catching those allusions.
Klono is just so *perfect* to swear by, which is why he exists. It’s not taking his name in vain, it’s his purpose to be sworn by — from his gadolinium guts to his curving carballoy claws — he’s the epitome of the Space God to swear by, to, and at. Unless your worship runs more to Noshabkeming, of course.
Though I guess I could have invoked the Great Ghu, but he was off having a beer with Ronson, and they didn’t want to be bothered.
I also love it when people catch the Demosthenes Locke reference, especially the juxtaposition, since in their original usage they’re diametrically opposed — not just in the Ender saga, but also historically, Demosthenes being a statist, and John Locke being one of the fathers of classical Republicanism and a great believer in the power of the individual.
Wait, wait, I don’t get it. I just caught up with the comics. Why did Barometer put on Hyperspace’s gauntlets? Didn’t he have some already, and USE them, against Synn/demon?
For some reason, the Beatles song “Fixing a Hole” immediately jumped into my mind (maybe because I got the remastered Sgt. Pepper for Christmas). Anyway, from all I’ve seen and understood via comments by other characters, if Alaric could have been creating instant potholes in people’s torsos, he would’ve. And while I hope Utopian doesn’t shed too many tears over Alaric, I also hope this incident doesn’t cause a ‘Supreme’ change in him, either.
Meanwhile, we can hope this gives Nick another stroke. And I’m glad to see that crack appeared to be Johhny Saturn’s humerus rather than his back.
Now, if they’ll just give Skorn a St. Bartholomew special…
Also, I’m loving the ‘haze of war’ background in these panels, Scott.
Thanks, Rob! That “haze of war” actually takes quite a bit of work, and there are quite a few steps in making it.
By “Supreme” change, do you mean the first incarnation of Supreme (pre Alan Moore) where he was a crazy, bloodthirsty version of Superman? If so, the answer is no, that’s not going to happen.
Yep, that’s what I meant. I read one issue of that. Hated it. The Alan Moore run was strange, but interesting in a “What if?” sort of way.
The haze effect is worth it, to me, anyway, because it keeps things in context while keeping the story front and center. JS (who, being a cop, knows about and lives with this sort of thing, as you pointed out) looming out of it behind Utopian somehow makes this strip for me.
…gnoo?
He’s had a stroke. He can’t talk very well, if hardly at all.
Looks like Alaric is missing something …
Score 2! And it looks like JS’s arm is hurt. So are Skorn and Tactical gonna go berserk now that they lost a lover ?
Walk it off Alaric! You big pansy!
Seriously, though, this is pretty much what I expected. Annoying boy scout characters tend to react badly the first time they kill someone. At least Utopian isn’t as one dimensional as Superman.
Am i off on the timeline? I thought tactical had been regenerated by the theft of power from ishtar? He still looks bad and not blind?
Maybe I missed a page?
btw this pagfe is awesome in it’s changes for the cast!
That wasn’t Tactical that was Wissenschaft.
Correct!
I know the number of actors in this drama can be confusing, but it kind of fits the epic scale we are aiming for.
Girl Genius, for example, which has a huge number of characters, can throw me now and again. I guess it just goes with the genre.
OK, let’s get this out of the way:
Tis but a scratch!
There. I feel better. Looks like someone is going to be shopping for new cybernetic parts.
If think it’s a little late for a cybernetic upgrade, here. He’s dead before he hits the ground. Best they could probably do is freeze his head for future reanimation on a new body. Alas, poor Alaric, we barely knew ye…
Hey, I can see my house from here!
Weeelllll, that’s it for Alaric. He’ll need new cybernetic lungs and heart, and I doubt medical tech is up to replacing those in time before he, y’know, dies. Unless he’s got superhuman self-healing abilities (which I doubt cause then he would have regrown his arm) then he’s done.
Now we get to see how powerful Tactical’s new armor is-’cause you KNOW he’ll be wanting to avenge his lover’s death.
Oh, Alaric’s dead.
(It may shock some of you, but I hate killing off my characters! I get really attached to them, and sometimes feel bad about it.)
Good, the resulting story will be far more interesting if Alaric doesn’t suddenly pop up later feeling all better. We get to see Utopian delaing with having (accidentally) taken a life, and get to see Tactical’s response, which I think is gonna be a doozy.
Looks like U is going to have to watch the blasts made in anger, he can really take a chunk out of you. And the poor guy is going to need theropy after this.
Ouch. D’you have any idea how much that STINGS?
Seriously. I’ve had it up to my eyeballs with pompous bilge from heroes who won’t use deadly force *when it’s warranted*. They will NEVER kill. Nope, never, ever! Never mind they can, and do, frequently *throw baddies through buildings*, they never go that extra little step and use force that MIGHT just kill them.
Wha?
Sorry, but when you’re so powerful you can punch out an armored car, and send out energy blasts that what, make enormous grilled cheese sandwiches, you’re exerting force with deadly propensity. SOMEDAY, you’re gonna hit the guy hard enough to pop his head clean off. Face it, it’s gonna happen. You’ll punch him in the chest, and instead of flattening him against the building with a great KABOOM, causing him to grimace and yell “curse you!”, he’ll clutch at his chest, scream, contort, and fall over with a super-infarction, because you just caused his left ventricle to explode.
And sorry, but when the bad guys wade in with huge monkey-mallets, firing energy blasts of their own, and shredding your friends with energy planes and shouting “die, die, die!” — for which they show NO remorse — this is clearly a self-defense situation, and even though a case might be made that Alaric had his back turned, we don’t know that he was actually *retreating*. Though his hammer had been destroyed, he might well have been turning and falling back to pick up a CAR to use as a new weapon. He’s just that kind of a mean little hairpin, you know? So a case could be made for justified use of force.
I teach self defense with firearms, and the first thing I do is have the person look me in the eye and tell me whether or not they will be willing to use the weapon to defend themselves if someone tries to kill them or cause them grievous bodily harm. If they can’t, or have reservations, I tell them to try pepper spray, or martial arts, or some other kind of defensive tool. If they have not wrestled with that demon AND WON ahead of time, they will hesitate when the time comes, and those seconds can mean their life. Worse, when you hesitate over a moral issue at the critical life-saving juncture, an attacker can TAKE YOUR WEAPON and use it on you, then use it on OTHERS. You have a responsibility to prevent that if possible, by acting, not maundering. If you can’t do it, it’s no dishonor. Just don’t. Use another method.
But a superhero — they have power, they have chosen to use it, they now must use it responsibly. If it is potentially deadly, they must face that propensity, and the fact that their opponent may not be as invulnerable as they are. They must also face that someday, they may have to stop — really STOP — a bad guy who is a danger not just to them, but to others.
And what is the difference between defending yourself and others using an energy blast from your hand, or a .45 acp frangible round, that can leave a cavity in flesh the size of a basketball?
Does make me wonder if Mr. Roboto-Illuminatus whatever it’s called with the eye in the pyramid isn’t somehow messing with Utopian’s power levels so he’ll go out of control.
Well, Demosthenes, I pretty much agree with everything you said. This world is not DC, where most characters would never willingly kill, and would die rather than let a heinous villain die. Most of the title characters wouldn’t think twice about it–self-defense! Johnny Saturn I or II wouldn’t worry about justification, nor would a military guy like Titanium Tom.
But, I propose that Utopian is different. We’ve seen him grow up a lot in this series, from a spoiled arrogant elitist to the hero he is now. But, he’s never had his values tested like this before. And, you’re right, it was inevitable.
I always think of Superman or Captain America, two characters with great ethics and integrity, and yet both have killed when it was the only option left to them. Now it’s time to see if Utopian can man up to it and join their ranks, or be broken.
I see Utopian’s reaction more in the vein of, “I didn’t know I could do that/I didn’t mean to do that!” Basically, you’ve shown him getting physically stronger, and reveling in his new-found strength. Because of this, he has no sense of “blow calibration” in combat – he’s used to projecting his power with a certain amount of effort, and just found out that that effort has resulted in a much larger amount of damage/effect than he’s used to. Seen that way, his reaction is understandable.
Indeed! That’s a good read on it.
This is not going to be a “whiny superhero mopes and cries” plot line. Actually, it’s got some interesting turns coming.
Good. I certainly hope it’s more of a “holy crap, how the heck did I do THAT???” kind of thing, and not a “woe is me, I have broken my Unbreakable Code, and am now no longer deserving of the title of Hero!”
The first is far more interesting, and frankly, I think it would be far more believable under the circumstances. The second is far too cheesy, and by Klono, has been so horribly overdone its chestnuts have chestnuts.
Wow… not only was that EPIC, but I think we have an Ender fan in our midst, because that’s the only place I’ve seen the names Demosthenes and Locke together. *lol*
I’ve never seen anybody else take the name of a Space God in vain before either, but DL, sounds to me like you have a very eclectic taste in SF literature.
On that note, I agree completely. The last thing I want to see from Johnny Saturn (as a strip) are over-done comic cliché’s, and Scott, you’ve done well to avoid them so far! Good work!
ESF gets *two* shiny new dimes for catching those allusions.
Klono is just so *perfect* to swear by, which is why he exists. It’s not taking his name in vain, it’s his purpose to be sworn by — from his gadolinium guts to his curving carballoy claws — he’s the epitome of the Space God to swear by, to, and at. Unless your worship runs more to Noshabkeming, of course.
Though I guess I could have invoked the Great Ghu, but he was off having a beer with Ronson, and they didn’t want to be bothered.
I also love it when people catch the Demosthenes Locke reference, especially the juxtaposition, since in their original usage they’re diametrically opposed — not just in the Ender saga, but also historically, Demosthenes being a statist, and John Locke being one of the fathers of classical Republicanism and a great believer in the power of the individual.
I think Ti Tom is going to buy Utopian a beer…or a brewery.
Beer Summit!
Wait, wait, I don’t get it. I just caught up with the comics. Why did Barometer put on Hyperspace’s gauntlets? Didn’t he have some already, and USE them, against Synn/demon?
As per Scott’s reply a few pages back, he’s linking them together for more power, which IS dangerous.
For some reason, the Beatles song “Fixing a Hole” immediately jumped into my mind (maybe because I got the remastered Sgt. Pepper for Christmas). Anyway, from all I’ve seen and understood via comments by other characters, if Alaric could have been creating instant potholes in people’s torsos, he would’ve. And while I hope Utopian doesn’t shed too many tears over Alaric, I also hope this incident doesn’t cause a ‘Supreme’ change in him, either.
Meanwhile, we can hope this gives Nick another stroke. And I’m glad to see that crack appeared to be Johhny Saturn’s humerus rather than his back.
Now, if they’ll just give Skorn a St. Bartholomew special…
Also, I’m loving the ‘haze of war’ background in these panels, Scott.
Thanks, Rob! That “haze of war” actually takes quite a bit of work, and there are quite a few steps in making it.
By “Supreme” change, do you mean the first incarnation of Supreme (pre Alan Moore) where he was a crazy, bloodthirsty version of Superman? If so, the answer is no, that’s not going to happen.
Yep, that’s what I meant. I read one issue of that. Hated it. The Alan Moore run was strange, but interesting in a “What if?” sort of way.
The haze effect is worth it, to me, anyway, because it keeps things in context while keeping the story front and center. JS (who, being a cop, knows about and lives with this sort of thing, as you pointed out) looming out of it behind Utopian somehow makes this strip for me.
The bubble should read “Uh Oh”.
Great Pay off I like good guys that kill great stuff! What is Skorn going to do now?
Hey, Dustin. The Skorn question will be answered very shortly.